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Episode 188


TBUCP E188 Pic

The gang is here to discuss all of the happenings from the month of May. While solicitations for August are discussed along with reviews of Batman #52 and Detective Comics #52, the majority of the cast is the review and discussion of DC Universe Rebirth. We will be back in two weeks, so be sure to leave your comments below!

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6 thoughts on “Episode 188

  1. Gerry Green

    Really glad you all are back. Missed the podcast.

    Loved hearing your different comments about Rebirth. I got on board to the DCU with New 52 so wasn’t particularly looking forward to going back to basics. However, I really loved Green Arrow Rebirth, I bought it because of Black Canary and very happy I did. I can appreciate Ed’s bloody minded enthusiasm but also understand Stella’s ‘fool me once’ hesitation. I am personally choosing to be positive even thought I am in mourning for the loss of some of my favorite DCYou titles. At least there is still Gotham Academy.

    Regarding Batman 66 I heard a rumor that Adam West and Burt Ward are in talks to do a Batman 66 animated project. Dustin, you alluded to something like that, sounds like you were dead on.

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  2. Donovan Morgan Grant

    Regarding DC Rebirth:

    What we have here is a weighing of values. This story is putting so much of DC Comics’ reputation and legacy on the line that it really is a special event in the company’s history. Like Dustin remarked, this is one of the most transparent, direct “apologies” from company to readership in the history of the industry. It’s Geoff Johns flagrantly admitting that the cries of grimdark tone, misused continuity and mis-characterization were all wholly accurate – so much so that it’s a thing of evil for Wally West to unite the DC Heroes to gather and defeat.

    So in my opinion much of the story of Rebirth is the story behind it. The most open secret in the world is that the line of comics grew darker and more violent since Dan Didio became in charge of the company. He’s explicitly said that was an intentional move he did to make DC more relevant in a “post-9/11 world, and used both Identity Crisis and Infinite Crisis as examples to establish that. Wally West says “10 years have been stolen, perhaps even more.” It’s been 10 years since Infinite Crisis and 13+ since Didio began working at DC. It goes along with our comments that even before the new 52, the books had gotten noticeably darker. What’s even more interesting is the reported fact that Didio and Johns have had strong disagreements for years about the direction of DC, with Didio reportedly getting his way each time ( the one argument he lost was trying to kill off Dick Grayson in Infinite Crisis where he was unanimously outvoted). So the company intrigue is beyond fan complaint, it goes to the heart of the inner workings at DC.

    Which is why while I understand Stella’s cross-armed “impress me” attitude towards the event, I admit to falling under this issue’s spell. The use of the original Wally West, the details of his origin and Barry’s emotional “how could I forget about you? ” line speaks volumes ass towards what’s happening and being recognized at DC comics. This is simply another time crossed read launch, this is a very navel gazing presentation about what has always made DC valuable in the hearts of its readers. This isn’t “One More Day”, this is quite literally tantamount to Joe Quesada apologizing for “One More Day” through the characters in the book. That’s what sets this apart from everything that’s come before and makes it different than just another reboot.

    I suppose there is the tendency for DC to dodgeball-team-pick and choose which characters stay and go that’s somewhat disquieting. On the one hand, they aren’t retconning new 52. We see the new 52 version of Wally in this book. On the other hand, they did just straight up kill off new 52 Superman and replace him with post-Crisis/pre-Flashpoint Superman. I get why that might be hard to take, but I’m personally weighing the values. I’m not sure where the Rose-tinted glasses Dustin and Ed were wearing came from regarding the 2012 line of bat books, because as I recall the majority were disliked by us on the Comic-Cast. We enjoyed Batman, Batman and Robin and Nightwing. Dark Knight was bad, Red Outlaws was awful, Catwoman was bad, Batwing was mediocre, Detective Comics was not great and Batgirl goes without saying. I personally do not care one scrap of an iota if we’re losing a majority of those stories to return to what had lasted longer and resonated better with fans. Again, They’re not retconning anything but continuity is falling into place. But quite frankly, if they did I can’t say A) I care or B) it’s not in DC’s nature to eventually bring back past elements of history into the present. I like Burnside Batgirl muchly, but were they to refund that for Oracle, I wouldn’t bat an eye. But I do get its a storytelling crutch of DC that’s a double-edged sword.

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  3. Donovan Morgan Grant

    My one feeling of apprehension comes from Watchmen’s invocation into the story. Beyond dragging that singular story into DC Comics continuity, inferring that it’s all Watchmen’s fault that comics got dark is really crass and immature to do. Watchmen seized the potential of comic book storytelling and made the industry way more respected. Just because it resulted in terrible books like Image Comics and the Marvel/DC books that tried to badly copy it doesn’t mean that Watchmen should never have happened. We still would’ve gotten Dark Knight Returns and Killing Joke and Death of Superman regardless. I hope Johns is smarter than to just prop up DC’s legacy by damning Watchmen. Or, if not him than his henchmen.

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  4. Ian Clark (@iantclark)

    Hey guys. I see that Stella is back to using her real name during the intro and send off. Speaking of Stella, I was a little surprised by her reluctance to be optimistic regarding the Rebirth direction. Normally she drive much of the positive input. I’m like Dustin in never being satisfied with the 15 or 20 year time gap in the new 52. On to my question. Does the team think that the DC Comic Universe is going to be tying into the television and movie universes somehow? There were a lot of correlations or common elements between the Rebirth special and the season 2 finally of the Flash (which should somehow impact both the Arrow and Legends of Tomorrow next seasons).

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  5. Dustin Fritschel Post author

    From Bob:;

    Hey guys. Always pleasant when I get alerted to a new episode of the comic cast!

    Unrelated: this week I finally got my hands on one of the books I always hear in people’s top ten but I hadn’t seen yet- Black Mirror.

    Wow. What an intense and well-layered book! This like a Lynchian level thriller, a story that would make a great film regardless of its bat-component. Awesome to read a story utilizing much more of the bat family. I didn’t realize how far back Snyder’s reach stretched into the bat-mythos, but stories like this help solidify his earning a place in one of the top bat storytellers.

    I followed up this reading with Gates of Gotham, another just insanely cleverly composed story shedding light on a very interesting era of bat mythology and more importantly Gotham’s history. It also takes that opportunity to use some steampunkish imagery in a batman story without it feeling forced or relegating it to elseworlds.

    Just wanted to say that it’s worth taking the time to look these older stories up. Especially since right now some peoples take on DCU current trajectory or recent history might leave them feeling confused/betrayed/annoyed… If that’s you, reach back a bit and be very entertained;)

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